Binson Echorec 2 - Distorted Echoes

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Binson Echorec 2 - Distorted Echoes

Postby Floydfactorman on Sun Jan 31, 2010 3:20 am

Hi, I recently/finally received a (1965) Echorec 2 from a guy in Milan. turns out that he used to work for Binson back in the 60's!! I've noticed a lot of talk about bad wiring and made sure to ask him about this. He advised me that there were definitely bad batches of them, but not all were bad and, apparently, the one I have is one of the good ones. I have not looked at the guts yet as I want to try it first. However, when taking off the back panel, all of the wiring I could see seemed to be in good shape. That is, it did not exhibit the signs of degradation/oily slime explained in the previous posts.

I finally found a plug adaptor to convert the Euro plug to a North American, fired it up and, overall, it seems to work well. The drum rotation and motor sounds a little clunky and noisy but it seems to work.

The only issue at the moment seems to be that the delays sound distorted, especially in the Echo and Rep modes. It's most notable on position 4 as that's the longest delay so you can hear the repeats clearer. It's more pronounced when I dig in a note on the guitar. In swell mode or with overlapping repeats the distortion is not as noticable.

I cleaned the heads and drum as shown by the Italian gentleman on Youtube. When it turned it back on, there seemed to be an improvement (or pehaps wishfull thinking ;-). However, after 10 mins, the repeats seemed to distort again.

The drum has a bit of a dark grey banding around the top half, though I'm not sure how to rate it in terms of wear.
I'll post pics soon.

I am going to try cleaning again. In the meantime, any advise on how to rectify this problem would be greatly appreciated.
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Re: Binson Echorec 2 - Distorted Echoes

Postby Hiwatt Bob on Thu Feb 04, 2010 6:36 pm

got any pics of the inside?

i've heard that before--that there were some units that were good and didn't need rewiring, but i've also heard the opposite, that all units need to be rewired. my friend bought an echorec 2 and was told that it was a "good wiring" one, it just didn't work. turned out--it needed to be completely rewired--even though outside it wasn't showing signs of decay, when he got into it, he found many bad wires. just saying you may want to look at it.

you should know that somewhat distorted echoes are normal--we're not talking pristine echoes with an echorec. any clips you have might help.

anyhow, you could try lowering the input volume or adjusting the trim pot controlling the input volume.
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Re: Binson Echorec 2 - Distorted Echoes

Postby lgk on Fri Feb 05, 2010 1:06 pm

Hi!

You say that after you have clean the heads and the drum like the man on You Tube do,
you got good echos for about 10 minutes. This man did not tell you everything.
The drum must have some oil after cleaning. You can drip some oil on the skins that are
on the 2 pins with skins. The drum shall never go dry. Dry metal going against dry metal
gives you friction and heat. This leave metal particals that will be your dirt on your
cleaning cotton. The drum and the heads will be worn very fast.
If it remains after this maybe you must adjust the bias a little.
Check the input levels that Hiwatt Bob wrote.

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Re: Binson Echorec 2 - Distorted Echoes

Postby MichaelE on Sun Feb 07, 2010 12:52 pm

You don't say where you are located, but can this machine run on 60 Hz? I'm assuming since it's manufactured in Italy that it's designed to run on 50 Hz.
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Re: Binson Echorec 2 - Distorted Echoes

Postby lgk on Sun Feb 07, 2010 1:39 pm

Hi MichaelE!

I live in Sweden and we got 230 Volt AC with 50 Hz today.
On the Echorec 2, ( if its in orginal ) you can change the input voltage to your 110 volt AC.
The motor (orginal) in the Echorec 2 is a 220 volts ac motor and its connecteted on the primary
side on transformer and to the 220 volt ac input.
This mean that the transformer when it is change to 110 volt ac input gives the motor 220 volt
beacuse the transformer will work like a spare trafo on the primary side.
If another ac motor ( not orginal ) is connected to the right working ac voltage
on the primary transformer side it will not take affect on wich input volt you choose.
The Rpm on your motor will increase about 20% when you change to 60Hz.
You get faster echos with 20% than we got here with 50Hz.
All other DC volts will be the same as it always be.
If you not have or it have been repaired with a other transformer than the orginal type
with only 220 volts ac input, you must use a spare trafo that transformer your 110 volts
to the 220 volts.

I hope this can help you little.

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Re: Binson Echorec 2 - Distorted Echoes

Postby lgk on Sun Feb 07, 2010 4:46 pm

Floydfactorman wrote:

"The drum rotation and motor sounds a little clunky and noisy but it seems to work."

Maybe you have a bad motor-axle mark on your pinch roller. It can be very small but
doing that it sound clunky. The echos can sounds bad too.

Dont leave the Binson Echorec with the pinch roller to the motor-axle when you not use it
It will be a mark.
Take a piece of hard paper between the axle and the pinch roller rubber or a toothpick
to lock the pinch roller sled to prevent this problem.


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Re: Binson Echorec 2 - Distorted Echoes

Postby Floydfactorman on Fri May 11, 2012 2:59 pm

Hi again, and thanks for the advice L-G! After a a period of 2-3 months of non-use (I know...that's a shame ;-( ), I turned it on last night and the sound was very modulated (like a slow chorus at extreme settings), with little to no delay present. This did improve a bit after I ran longer, as the delays became more audible and the modulation seemed to decrease a bit. Perhaps I need to run it longer? I will try. I have started the unit before after extended periods of non use and this never seemed to be a problem.

As I mentioned before, there continues to be a minor creaking sound coming from the drum area. Is this something that can be lubricated somewhere? Could it be seizing up a bit? The pinch roller seems ok as I took your advice regarding locking the sled.

Thanks!

Andre
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Re: Binson Echorec 2 - Distorted Echoes

Postby audioexmachina on Thu Jun 28, 2012 1:35 pm

Floydfactorman wrote:As I mentioned before, there continues to be a minor creaking sound coming from the drum area. Is this something that can be lubricated somewhere? Could it be seizing up a bit? The pinch roller seems ok as I took your advice regarding locking the sled.


Hello Andre,

first thing would be to understand if it's due to 1) the motor, 2) the rubber wheel, 3)the drum. To find out you should:

1) switch on the unit, then compress the rubber wheel's spring with your hand, so that the wheel doesn't touch neither the motor axle, nor the drum. This way the motor is running, the two other components are not. Do you hear that noise? If you do, then it's the motor axle.

2) switch off the unit, keep the spring compressed as per step 1), then turn ANTICLOCKWISE the drum with our other hand. Do not turn it clockwise, as it will tend naturally to brake (that's due to how the heads are angled). Do you hear that noise? If you do, then it's the drum. In this case is unlikely that the drum axle makes noise (it's a very high quality assembly), usually it's something touching the drum surface, the heads most of the times.

3) If you don't hear any noise after the two steps above, then it's the rubber wheel.
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Re: Binson Echorec 2 - Distorted Echoes

Postby Floydfactorman on Wed Sep 12, 2012 3:37 pm

Thank you for your reply and sorry for the late acknowledgement...I don't seem to get any message response notifications here. Any ways, I seemed to have fixed the modulation problem by pressing the sled a little harder against the pinch roller by tightening the spring screw.

I'll try your suggestions regarding the clicking noise and let you know how it goes.
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